As far as crimes against Hispanics, I really do not want to know the statistics, all I can tell you at this point is that I see some of these numbers, like the white to Hispanic population ratio, and I find them unbelievable. When you live in a city where in order to find a good job you are REQUIRED to be bi-lingual? or when you call your bank and you have to choose which language you wish to use, and the ONLY options are English or Spanish? That simply says to me, that there is a much higher ratio of Hispanics than are actually being reported. Is this perhaps due to the fact that there is literally such a high ratio of illegal residents in this country?

I’m sorry perhaps I stand alone when I say that English is the primary language of this country and employers should not be allowed to put a language restriction on job requirements, schools should not have papers that are bi-lingual, and I surely should not have to choose what language to use when I deduct money from my bank account!!!.

There were 5 “White” kids in my high school, and all of them were severely beat, or chased off by Hispanic gangs. The neighborhood I grew up in used to be clean and upstanding, now it is a dust bowl with trash filling the gutters and walls that have enough spray paint on them that you cannot even make out the original color of the wall!

My life is one double standard after the next, I cannot get this job because I do not speak Spanish, yet I am an American citizen and the job is in America? not to mention people like me who do live here, have to fight to survive, because the Hispanics who are allowed to own homes in Mexico, are able to live much better off ten dollars an hour than any U.S resident EVER could. This causes employers to keep their wages down, and hire these people who are willing to take the jobs at a lower wage, does that not incite some animosity? Of course it does, it’s outrageous!!!

Imagine this, an A.S.E certified auto technician, in 1995 made a flag hour rate of $20, thats for every hour of labor the shop billed out, the employee earned $20. move forward ten years and the flag hour rate is LOWER? how can this be?, simple. because an unskilled laborer who is willing to do the same work for $7 instead of $20 means there is no need for the shop to shell out any money to the trained technician who will demand his worth. That caused a huge decline in quality of repairs, in 2005 we saw a shop return rate of 80%, or in common terms, 80% of my shops clients came in with previous problems that another shop was unable to satisfactorily repair.

I’m not saying that they are not hard workers, god knows they are some of the hardest workers around. But that hard work is plagued by a severe lack of skill, and in a field like automotive, where there is actually some trade school skills required to do complex diagnostics, they have caused a huge deficit in the private shop owners realm. This has lead up to consumers believing that only the dealership has the ability to do the repairs correctly. When in fact, the dealerships are actually the majority employer of these unskilled laborers, these “R&R (Remove and Replace)” tactics have killed the auto repair economy and that’s just for starters.

Remember back in the days when you were a high school kid you could get a job at the fast food place to make some money for that first car? or that motorcycle? Well now days, teens and adults alike can barely get a job with a fast food chain, because these legal immigrants who traverse the border daily, have filled ALL of these positions. Now when you go to a drive through, and you try to order a meal, if you don’t speak Spanish, you have a language barrier!

Perhaps we could employ these guerrilla tactics back on them, by living in the U.S and working in Mexico…Only problem is, they pay about 2 dollars a day, and I could never afford my housing nonetheless my internet, or my phone.

So in closing I leave you with a realistic daily view from someone who lives in the middle of it, and has to deal with it every day. And now maybe you have a better understanding of why these crimes are committed, I’m under the impression that these crimes are meant to be aimed at illegal immigrants, but are being misdirected by the actual legal ones that traverse our country’s great border every morning, flooding the lower states with traffic jams, and strangling our economy by forcing wages down.

One thing: I would suggest that learn to spell, write coherently and open your mind beyond ignorant, multi-cultural blather.

PS:
There are already too many people in the USA, the USA doesn’t need anymore of them.

I hope you are not one of them…..

One thing. It is one thing to respect people but your opinion does not force the respect but disgust and a sense of advanced obscurantism. I would suggest you to travel a bit leave your box and experience brotherhood and respect and intelligence. Obviously you seem ignare and racist or anyway intolerant in all aspect, a category that should disappear in the new world. Get some education before you express yourself…maybe that way you will not spray your bad breath…..

That sounds racist, guy. I don’t agree with denigrating all white people if it’s just a few you dislike. If my skin were really white, I’d take offense to that, and I don’t really blame those who might.

Too, you’ve got to be as unbiased as posible. We humans have to watch that constantly. The three people you mentioned above are all complaining about people entering the country illegally. I couldn’t find anything where they were against legal immigration. In fact all three support it. It relgates your entire argument to file thirteen by distorting the facts due to emotion.

You raised an economic matter, also about the cost of picking our own lettuce and other farm labor. If you Google the subject you’ll see that many people who decry illegal immigration, and if I’m rembering correctly, about 80% of the populastion does, the ones I read about all are in favor of guest worker programs, but Congress won’t get in gear and enact anything along those lines.

But, you know, I really think the immigration issue isn’t going to get a lot of attention in 09, because the economy is still falling precipitously and several very prominant Trend Analysts, Gerald Celente in particular, are predicting a depression greater than any the world has ever seen, so I don’t think the US is going to be able to bail out everybody and pay for extra social benefits too. In fact, from what this well-respected man says, we’re going to have to resort to growing our own gardens for food.

He was on CNN. Here’s the link along with an explanation from an author on Celente:

“Celente is not your garden variety doom-and-gloom crackpot. Celente, director of Trends Research Institute, forecasted the subprime mortgage financial crisis and the decline of the dollar a year ago and gold’s current rise in May. He also predicted the 1997 Asian Currency Crisis and the fall of the Soviet Union. “We are going to see economic times the likes of which no living person has seen,” he told United Press International.”

Here’s how he describes his organization. “As Political Atheists — independent thinkers, unencumbered by rigid ideology, political persuasions, fixed agendas or conventional wisdom — The Trends Research Institute observes and analyzes the current events forming future trends for what they are – and not for the way they want them to be.”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46MEqEgdLTg

If anybody has any valid information on the issue, I’d REALLY appreciate getting it. Right now I’m planning on growing a garden. I live in a rural area, but anybody can grow one. It’s possible to get a LOT of veggies from just a small garden. My wife’s mother grows one, and she does canning also. She has a food pantry filled with what looks to me like hundreds of jars of food.

It would’t hurt living close to a body of water that still has fish in it. I mean, uncontaminated like few are nowadays.

Maybe the “Mexicans” should simply stay on their side of the border and thus would avoid such issues?

Just now on the local news, another story was reported about ethnic slurs and anti-Obama graffiti vandalism sprayed on cars and property in Long Island. The northeast is surely not the place I hoped it would be when I left the south so many years ago.

How unfortunate that at this great moment in our nation’s history, it is just an excuse for some to react with violence and more hate. Anyone with any sense could have predicted this but we must not let it fester.

Lou Dobbs, Rush Limbaugh, Tom Tancredo, the list is filled to the brim. Intolerance, fear, scapegoating, reducing people to what we don’t know about them as opposed to what we do know. Them vs. us. It’s never ending, as we witnessed in the recent Presidential election, when Sarah Palin upped the ante on carefully scripted inflammatory speeches that invited instant hateful reactions from large crowds that felt like mobs during those moments.

While a lot of the country and most of the world has experienced a moment of euphoria after the victory of President-elect Obama, the demons of zenophobia, nativism and racial hatred are rearing their ugly heads. I am not surprised that it happened in a New York minute.

It happened in the other suburbs of New York as well. A young black student was brutally beaten by a military thug because he was excited about the election of Obama. I’m sure there have been many such incidents since 11/04/08.

But I don’t expect those non-Hispanics amongst us to take action, who stand for tolerance and unity, who understand the plight of immigrants who have come to this country without documentation simply because for them there was and is no line to stand in, who are economic refugees. I don’t expect that most of us will have the courage or take the time to rally around these vulnerable people who chose between starving or filling undesirable jobs, willing to accept poor conditions and wages that no one born in this country in their right mind would want no matter how bad things get, not when we have the right to unemployment insurance, food stamps, and other government assistance.

But those that spew hatred truly believe that an undocumented (call them illegal if you must) immigrant is entitled to those benefits. When will someone explain to them that nothing is further from the truth. They can NOT get free anything, with the exception of emergency room services, that no one can be denied. Then they are billed and many do what they can to pay. Perhaps the employers are to blame for that.

Perhaps the employers are to be blamed for a lot. Including contributing to the “push-pull” economy that benefits all of us. Teach your children that, Long Islanders. Research the cause and effect of illegal immigration. They didn’t just show up in your back yard because they thought they thought being a nuisance to your sequestered bedroom communities would be good for their health. If you are so appalled by the sight of brown skinned people dominating your once bleached blissful landscapes, stop buying the products that they produce or start washing your own dishes after going to the restaurants where they do your dirty work.

As everyone moans and groans while prices for food and services consistently and steadily rise because of current economic conditions, be prepared for how much more they would rise if all those “Mexicans” that your children want to “f” up, suddenly disappeared and those Americans that you insist would take those jobs at exponentially higher salaries with benefits, just imagine how much more you’ll be paying for that lettuce, those tomatoes, that red wine, those home renovations.

I hope that others like me will stand up and be counted for. There is no time to lose to do what all good religions preach, to be our brother’s keepers.

A definitive search finds you are exactly right, Jonathan.

In addition to that, the SPLC published a report by Suzy Buchanan entitled “The Rift,” and it highlighted CONSIDERABLE black/Hispanic fighting.

http://www.splcenter.org/intel.....sp?aid=548
Here’s a brief excerpt”

The Rift
Evidence of a divide between blacks and Hispanics mounting
By Susy Buchanan

Intelligence Report
Summer 2005

In May, Mayor-elect Antonio Villaraigosa spoke to parents and students from Jefferson High School, where police gang units were brought in, after the third major brawl in six weeks.
(AP Wide World Photos)

One after another, the reports have rolled in. From Florida to California, Nevada to New Jersey, even as far away as the state of Washington, the news is getting harder to ignore: There’s trouble brewing between blacks and browns.
At Hug High School in Reno, Nev., an emergency task force began work last October after a series of fights between black and Hispanic students that interim Schools Superintendent Paul Dugan said reflected “definite racial tensions.” In Monroe, Wash., similar tensions shot up after a Mexican flag was torn down and thrown into a bathroom and several off-campus fights broke out. In Chicago, seven students were arrested after an interracial brawl in January left teachers and security guards injured and parents complaining of mounting racial strife.

But it was in schools in California, where so many of the nation’s trends first take shape, that this disturbing conflict was most obvious.

On Nov. 8, hundreds of black and Latino students got into two separate battles in the streets around Wilmer Amina Carter High School in Rialto. Two days later, another interracial fight broke out on campus, and four days after that a huge battle erupted in the lunchroom, leaving 57 of the hundreds of students involved injured. At around the same time, more than 20 police officers broke up a series of street fights between black and Latino students outside Fremont High School in Oakland that involved as many as 150 participants and bystanders. In San Jacinto, a riot at San Jacinto High School between black and Hispanic students resulted in three arrests, six suspensions and the lockdown of 1,700 students. Some 500 students were involved in the fight, and police reported some arriving parents added fuel to the fire by shouting racial slurs and urging their children to keep up the battle. Similar racial conflicts hit Crenshaw, Manual Arts and Jordan high schools in Los Angeles.

The Presumed Alliance
Traditionally, black and brown activists have seen themselves in a natural alliance in a country historically dominated by whites — an alliance of mostly poorer, darker-skinned minorities whose struggles are not dissimilar. But like the civil-rights-era alliance between blacks and Jews, the black/brown coalition has grown more and more strained. Many blacks resent what is seen as Hispanics leapfrogging them up the socioeconomic ladder, and some complain of the skin-color prejudices that are particularly strong in some Hispanic countries, notably Mexico. Just this May, the Rev. Al Sharpton bitterly demanded that Vicente Fox apologize after the Mexican president made what some blacks interpreted as a racist comment. Similarly, many Hispanics say they are treated in racist ways by blacks, some of whom have apparently singled out undocumented immigrants for robbery and worse.

The police are more than likely to “under-profile” as they correctly fear that they’ll be fired, sued or persecuted by federal agencies for “racism”.

“Latino and Black Hate Crimes: The New Face of Hate

The arrest of Jonathan Fajardo brought a momentary breath of relief to Charlene Lovett. Fajardo is one of two purported Latino gang members charged with the murder of Lovett’s daughter, 14- year-old black teen …”

“These aren’t just garden variety white on black hate crimes. Blacks and Latinos are committing many of these crimes, and they are victimizing each other. This represents two tormenting new trends. One is that blacks and Latinos now commit the majority of hate crimes in L.A.”

(http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....38396.html)

What about “garden variety” Black on White hate crimes? Oh well, at least White people didn’t get too much blame beyond that single comment!

Yes, I’ve read George Orwell’s book, 1984.

So, do you consider Caesar Chavez a “Nazi” for turning illegals into the INS?

“I do believe (as I said before) that illegals need to do whatever they can to become legal.”
I do too by way of self-deportation. They may need a bit of “encouragement” from time to time too; if they knew that they couldn’t rely on their fellow Hispanics for protection, that would be one less incentive to stay.

“… what would all the business owners who employ illegals and pay them substandard wages and force them to work in substandard and often unsafe conditions do without all the hard working illegasl that they employ?”

They would stop dumping costs for which they don’t cover onto the taxpayer. I’m all for people turning in businesses, who employ illegals. Maybe this could be called the TIB (Turn in Businesses) program, sort of a “Just Say No”-like undertaking.

“Ah yes, Irving. But you missed my point.”

Sorry, old guy, but it is you who are missing the points.

My response was data I researched that involved both illegal and legals in this country, and I juxtaposed nothing. I provided information on both, because the issue is really a Latin one, legal or illegal.

In fact, my inquiry was one in which I was trying to gather more information, but you responded as if I were trying to pull some kind of trick. If you had additional info, all you had to do was write it out without any uncalled for denigrations. If I check it out and find it to be wrong I’ll say so, but I’m not going to call you a liar for being mislead.

Do try to keep your paranoia under control, old guy.

Well, in fact, I did check out your sources and found that they’re not accurate, and I did that by comparing what you provided by double checking your claims against statistics from the United States Department of Justice. It takes quite a bit of searching.

I’m a stckler for accuracy, eliminating all the emotion involved as much as I can as a human, but you seem to be hung u on a particular view.

You seem to be saying don’t confuse the issue with facts, I have all the facts I need from groups that have an agenda and they slant their information to fit that agenda.

But, in the final analysis, if you want to believe what you do, please feel free to do so. My original inquiry was not directed at you, and I really don’t want to exchange ideas from a true believer on any particular subject.

For instance:

There have been dozens of national studies examining immigration and crime and they all came to the same conclusion; immigrants are more law abiding than U.S. citizens. A 2007 study by the Immigration Policy Center(ICP) found that immigrants whether legal or illegal are substantially are less likely to commit crimes or to be incarcerated than U.S. citizens. Here’s a couple of examples as cited by the ICP:

1.) Incarceration rates for U.S. born in the 18-39 age group was 5 times higher than incarceration rates for foreign born men in the same age group.
2.) Data from the census and other sources show that for every ethnic group incarceration rates for young men are lowest for immigrants even for those who are at least education and least acculterated.

As for the rest, you can look it up on your own.
Hence, the study noted, the fact that many immigrants enter the country illegally are framed by anti-immigration forces as an assualt to the “rule of law”, thereby reinforcing the false impression that immigrants and criminality are linked.

Since the FBI and DOJ`s data seemed to be a bit sketchy on the issue of Immigrants and Crime, I suggest you can also look up *unbiased* research by the American Policy Program:

“Truth about Illegal Immigration and Crime.”

http://americas.irc-online.org/am/4903

“By race

In 2007, the races of the 6,965 known hate crime offenders were as follows:

” * 62.9 percent were white.
* 20.8 percent were black.
* 4.9 percent were groups made up of individuals of various races (multiple races, group).
* 1.0 percent were American Indian/Alaskan Native.
* 0.7 percent were Asian/Pacific Islander.
* 9.8 percent were unknown.”

So it looks like White people commit “hate” crimes at a lower rate than Blacks; Whites are about 65% of the population and Blacks are about 13%.

Strangely absent are hate crimes committed by “Hispanics”. Hmmmm … maybe they simply don’t commit hate crimes? More than likely most of them are put into the White category thus making White people look worse than they are. I’m sure you’ve all read about how Hispanic gangs are cleansing Los Angeles of Blacks?

Additionally skewing the statistics, which I admit is my impression from reading countless articles of attacks against Whites while saying/yelling racial slurs by Blacks, is the reluctance of authorities to classify such crimes as hate crimes. When the roles are reversed such crimes are quickly classified as hate crimes.

Note the low numbers of hate crimes/criminals. It is dwarfed by the ~1.7 million violent interracial crimes committed each year. Talk about the white elephant in the room!

“Hispanics had a much higher crime rates, as a percentage of their population than White.”

However, I’m not disputing this fact and I’m not sure why you bothered asking me. But regardless of the outcome of the criminal stats quoted therein. You foolishly juxtaposed “Hispanics” with “Illegal Aliens” and that’s not a fact based assertion but a sketchy assumption. The point I was making was that Americans(that includes all racial ethnicities) commit more crimes than Illegal Aliens and Illegal Aliens in prisons only make up a very small percentage of the prinson population. This particular answer could be found in another forum where Mark Potak writes a letter to the American Legion(see the next forum).
But simply ask yourself this:
Who commits the most *HATECRIMES*???
The answers lies in the FBI`s hatecrime statistic data. And I’d be more than glad to debate you on this.
Whites, Caucasians and Aryans commit the vast majority of hatecrimes in the U.S. Some of the answers are already quoted in this article regarding Latinos and Immigration.(see above).

You post sparked my interest.

I scanned the DOJ web site pretty thoroughly and nothing at all was reported on illegal aliens, so far as the commission of crime is concerned.

However, I did find stats revealing that Hispanics in general had much higher crime rates, as a percentage of their population than whites. Their crime rate was lower than blacks, however.

I found a couple of articles quoting The Border Patrol higher ups, and they asserted that 10% of all illegals coming across the border are criminals.

If anybody can find additional info , please let me know, because I’m a stickler for tossing out all emotion and basing my beliefs on facts.

Maybe if illegal “Hispanics” would learn to respect the law and stay on their side of the border there would be far less problems for everyone.

If I recall correctly, there are about 43 million Hispanics in the USA and about 12-20 million illegals. So it’s no wonder people associate Hispanics with illegals when up to almost half of *could* be illegal.

I’d recommend that we have a new national program where legal Hispanics vigorously turn in illegals just like Cesar Chavez did. We could call it TIL (Turn in Illegals) similar to President Nixon’s TIP (Turn in Pushers) and President Ford’s WIN (Whip Inflation Now) programs. I think that would really help.

Freedom!