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Hatewatch is managed by the staff of the Intelligence Report, an investigative magazine published by the Alabama-based civil rights group Southern Poverty Law Center.
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[MT]
Oath Keepers Gather Strength in Montana
Bozeman Daily Chronicle
/August 24, 2009
Oath Keepers organizer Elias Alias, a.k.a. Franklin Shook, wants every county in Montana to have a chapter of the growing “Patriot” group that’s composed mostly of military and law enforcement veterans and personnel.
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on August 27th, 2009 at 2:51 pm
And after reading this article, why would the Souther Poverty Law Center be concerned?
The article lists valid claims; George Bush did illegally expand the Executive Branch of the government, President Obama has not recended those expansions and in fact is trying to expand them for his own political gain.
The Souther Poverty Law Centers claim to fame is protecting peoples rights; if anything it seems logical that the Law Center should be supporting the groups that wants to expand personal freedom correct? or have I missed something here?
on August 27th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
Awesome. Law enforcement and the military are all required to take this oath, an oath without expiration, upon joining either profession. That they should form a membership in which this oath is high-lighted is patriotic indeed. AFter all, it has always been government that has threatened our freedoms, not the people.
on August 27th, 2009 at 3:55 pm
May I politely point out as a supporter of SPLC that SPLC seems to be overly concerned about this – a group devoted to upholding the Constitution and prepared to resist illegal orders, including domestic uses of the military should we fall the rest of the way into tyranny. We need to recognize that this is very different from the militia movements of yesterday. Sure, there are right-wingers and haters who will align with this group and use what should be a healthy distrust of government as an un-healthy justification for their activities, but who all the same by clinging to the Constitution would be ultimately limited in any hate activities by its governance of law. Why SPLC does not ally with this group is not clear, unless someone is playing politics and reacting where one should be leading. It seems we are losing an opportunity to make friends instead of enemies here. Some people cannot see outside of the artificial and destructively false “right-vs-left” dichotomy and it would be unfortunate indeed to find SPLC falling into the other side of that same trap. It is the haters who succumb to fear and operate under a hidden agenda. In this reaction I see the beginnings of an unfounded fear about a movement which on the surface is not a cause for alarm. We should be openly espousing a return to Constitutional law (ending torture, illegal invasions, civil liberties violations) and judge this group by its decent principles. May I humbly urge that SPLC makes friends with leadership of this group and obtains a pledge to exchange information and work together to keep it free of white supremacist shenanigans. Both sides would benefit and we would all feel more secure knowing that we are building a movement for Constitutional stability without getting into mistakes made by earlier movements for Constitutional restoration, which is a legitimate concern for people of all races.
on August 27th, 2009 at 4:06 pm
I have a radically different viewpoint.
I accept as factual that U. S. troops are being deployed in the US to perform illegal and unconstitutional actions.
I accept that U.S. troops are now being programmed to kill their family and neighbors.
I accept the Oklahoma city bombing was not a result of fertilizer in a van but a result of explosives planted in the buildihnjg in advance and that local newscasts,m later censured, commented on the finding of unexploded devices.
I accept that the oathkeeps are not a seditious paramilitary group but rather police and military personel who agree that they will not follow illegal orders to kill U.S. Citizens or enter homes to confiscate weapons and the like.
I feel like SPLC is failing to do adequate research and seems to be mired down in accepting government/corporate facist propaganda and propagating inaccurate information.
This is a great disappointment to me.
on August 27th, 2009 at 5:02 pm
Why is this story of great American Patriots listed in hatewatch news?
on August 27th, 2009 at 5:52 pm
I don’t understand how splc can put such a derogatory spin on something as necessary as what these men are doing!!! I am not a member of the Oath Keepers, but I think I speak for all Americans who still believe in that beautiful piece of parchment that is the United States Constitution. You either can’t see what’s going on, or you’re a part of the problem. I urge all americans to stand up and pull the blinders off. What our government is doing is unconstitutional!!!( Bailouts, War w/out congress consent, etc…) When did being a patriot become a bad thing?!?!?!?!?!?
on August 27th, 2009 at 6:00 pm
Go to the oath keeper’s website and you will see a clip of a rude angry Marine saying the Nazi’s were Socialist leftist who took over the German auto industry. He says something about Nancy Pelosi wearing a swastika on her arm. He then tells his congressman that he violated the constitution and demands to know when he will keep his oath to uphold and defend it.
Yes, this group claims it is all about the oath and not about the politics of hate. Then explain this lie and hate filled screed on there home page.
on August 27th, 2009 at 6:01 pm
I am soooo fed up with these racists claiming to be “patriots.” They are just hate groups who can’t get over the fact that Obama won the election. Sometimes I wish they would do what they keep talking about and move to another state (or a desert island) and we could surround them with barbed wire so they can’t continue their hate campaigns.
I’m white, I worked to get Obama elected and I have the best health care imaginable. However, even if I do have to pay a few more dollars in taxes, I will gladly do so it if means that everyone in this country has healthcare.
The healthcare in this country is a national disgrace!
on August 27th, 2009 at 6:02 pm
It doesn’t matter what these people call themselves. They are an unofficial gang obeying no rules but their own. So, why should anyone trust their motives?
on August 28th, 2009 at 12:52 am
How can opposing federal usurpation of State and individual rights be considered “extremist”? And what makes the SPLC capable of deciding that movements to keep that from happening will become violent?
on August 28th, 2009 at 8:07 am
By the way, as a ten year veteran of the military, I took my oath three times. It never expires. I also am listed as a potential terrorist by my own government on the following grounds: 1- I am a veteran. 2- I believe in the constitution 3- I am a Ron Paul Supporter . i am sure there are more reasons, but these insanities all fall under our very own Department of Homeland Security guidelines for terrorist threats. As for my reaction? I am sickened by a government that believes that these three items in themselves make a person worthy of putting on some domestic terrorist watchlist. Yet, our own government isn’t on any hatewatch list here. Please explain. Oh, and I am in agreement with the above poster who questions the official version of the OKC bombing. I also question the official story in the 9/11 horror (no, I don’t know the answers, I just don’t buy the official bs). I also believe our wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, and the terrorizing of Pakistan is illegal and unconstitutional. I also am for the complete investigation of Bush/Cheney/Rumspfeld/CIA/FBI/DEA /NSA/FDA for their crimes. CIA for torture and drug smuggling (I believe they are the world’s largest drug cartel), FBI (for their roles in the first WTC bombing, MLK assassination, 9/11, OKC investigation, and even the JFK assassination), the DEA for it’s misuse of govt funds to destroy old hemp crops in Kansas and call it a pot raid and also for obstructing and obscuring justice in it’s rabid and unscientific zeal against marijuana, NSA for violating our privacy with it’s electronic email eavesdropping (most especially in it’s known and public center in San Fransisco) and the FDA for it’s refusal to keep aspartame off the market (it should have never been put on the market, but Rumsfeld had a lot of pull with Reagan), and it’s entire review process on all items, but most especially with pharmaceutical drugs. These are my beliefs, but it is rather telling that the first three reasons are enough in such a “free” society to put me on a terror watch list. Maybe the oathkeepers are correct.
on August 28th, 2009 at 11:13 am
I thank the SPLC for their continued diligence in researching hate/violent groups. There is always a kernel of truth in these movements…but to use the names of Martin Luther King, Jr. and Gandhi is blasphemous. Anyone who knows an inkling of what these men stood for knows that guns and violence were NEVER an option. I continue to support the SPLC and, again, thank them for their dedication. (I increased my monthly gift…wish I had more to give!)
on August 28th, 2009 at 12:06 pm
So who is it exactly, that the Oath Keepers are hating on? Honestly, take a step back and rub your eyes and look again.
on August 28th, 2009 at 12:15 pm
I wonder why SPLC and other socialists so rabidly oppose the Constitution and liberty. There is no such thing as “hate speech” in the Constitution. All speech is the same — just harmless little words. And why are inanimate objects such as guns so vilified? Give me liberty, or give me death. And if you try to kill me, you will find me ready. They don’t call us Minutemen for nothing. The day your socialist economy collapses will find me laughing, because you put your faith in the creations of man.
on August 28th, 2009 at 12:25 pm
Sandy,
So 8 years of hanging Bush in effigy, threatening to kill him, equating him with Hitler, and generally maligning all conservatives as “NeoCons” wasn’t hate??? WTF… But anyone on the right who even dares to disagree with His Imperial Majesty is filled with hate and needs to be “watched” according to you and your fellow travellers.
And RACISM??? I voted for Alan Keyes in the primaries, but OMG I guess he isn’t black enough, or he’s a Tom ’cause he doesn’t step and fetch for the Libs and do their bidding. Never mind that The Messiah is half WHITE, but nobody seems to mention that at all, huh?
Gimme a break. You watch WAY too much TV, obviously.
on August 28th, 2009 at 12:29 pm
Sandy, no one compared the oath keepers to Ghandi or King excepting you. By the way, did you ever read that little document entitled “The Declaration of Independence?” It had something in there about violence for future generations. I think they may have used that very same violence so that you might sit safely at your computer and type away in shock at how violent the real world really is. In fact, I wonder how you feel about all the wars we are supposedly fighting for “Democracy” all over the world. As if these other people want the so-called freedoms we offer. Most especially since we don’t offer it at all to them. Instead, these are wars fought in which people die so that you can have the oil used to build that very computer you type on.
on August 28th, 2009 at 1:37 pm
Martin Luther King, Jr. and Gandhi were great men, and their greatness came about because they resisted tyranny. That’s what the Oath Keepers are about. It shows how far SPLC has devolved that they are now labeling followers of Gandhi as vicious radicals. It seems that SPLC is more interested these days in keeping the money flowing steadily in than confronting real threats to our liberty and security.
on August 28th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
@Sandy
Here’s a little ‘hate speech’ from Gandhi:
“Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest.”
on August 28th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
So, on Mac’s recommendation, I went to the Oathkeeper’s website and read it. I find Kate De Braose’s description humorous at best, since all I could find was a group of people demanding that everyone DOES follow the supreme law of the land and uphold their oaths. Interesting that doing those two things is now suspect… A sad commentary on the state of the country and of its citizens.
on August 28th, 2009 at 4:53 pm
I think groups like SPLC that don’t see their own hatred, bigotry and racism are afraid that so many people are now standing up for their rights and freedom, and that the concept of Freedom is now becoming mainstream. Once mainstream America has a taste of real freedom and self-reliance, organizations like the SPLC will shrivel up and blow away in the dust.
People are tired of the propaganda and lies by the media, as when the media propagated the spin on the protest by a “black” man who exercised his right to open carry a fire arm in pheonix, az as a “white” racially motivated protest. anyone with half a brain knows that media intentionally turned a freedom issue into a race issue for their own biased motives:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....r_embedded
Oathkeepers are standing up for our freedom and standing against tyranny, they accept anyone who is military, law enforcement or a peacekeeper no matter their race, gender, or sexual orientation. Anyone who would consider them as a hate group is nothing more than a hate group themselves supporting a tyrannical government.
on August 28th, 2009 at 6:59 pm
Hate group? Men and women who are prepared to live up to or die for an oath they swore to protect and defend the constitution of the United States are a hate group? Oh no, of course not. They are not a hate group, you hate them. Hatewatch is you watching them with hatred. The weak and fearful who aren’t prepared to live up to or fulfill any oath, who wouldn’t give their life to any cause are always envious and hateful of those who would and do.
on August 28th, 2009 at 9:38 pm
Mac, the Nazis WERE the socialist party of Germany in WWII. That’s what Naziism is. The “rude” angry Marine was exactly right in calling is Congressman on the carpet for violating his oath to uphold and defend the Constitution, for most of these Congresscritters swear the same oath, then proceed to govern as if the Constitution doesn’t exist.
Sandi, it’s not about racism; it’s about the fact that Obama is “Hopenchangeing” America into a Communist country, and he has the backing of Congress, and the help of the mainstream media to do it. If you continue to believe it’s about racism, then you are an irredeemable idiot.
Sandy, there are many times when guns and violence are the ONLY answer. How do you think we won our independence fro England in the American Revolution? Harsh words? They didn’t work in all our entreaties with England, and neither did kind words. Yes, war is often a roll of the dice as far as whether the aggressors or the defenders win, but if abject slavery is the only alternative to war, I’ll take war. On a personal level, many people defend themselves from criminal attack with guns and the inherent threat of return violence, but you will not see these reported in the mainstream media. Yo can only find these on pro-gun blogs, or “The American Rifleman”, published by the *gasp!* NRA.
You three need to educate yourselves better, or get out of the U.S.!
on August 28th, 2009 at 10:22 pm
Actually, Sandy, you’re wrong.
First off, “blasphemy” per Merriam-Webster:
“1 a : the act of insulting or showing contempt or lack of reverence for God b : the act of claiming the attributes of deity
2 : irreverence toward something considered sacred or inviolable.”
I guess you’re free to worship fallible human beings if you want to.
Per “Between Threat and Reality: The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People and the Emergence of Armed Self-Defense in Clarksdale and Natchez, Mississippi, 1960–1965,” Annelieke Dirks, Ohio State University:
“Even Martin Luther King Jr.—the icon of nonviolence—employed armed bodyguards and had guns in his house during the early stagesof the Montgomery Bus Boycott in 1956. Glenn Smiley, an organizer of the strictly nonviolent and pacifist Fellowship of Reconciliation (FOR), observed during a house visit that the police did not allow King a weapon permit, but that ‘the place is an arsenal.’”
You–and SPLC–also ignore the role of the Deacons for Justice and Self Defense. Google them if you’r honest enough to have your worldview challenged.
As for Gandhi, explain these quotes:
A disarmed India has no power of resistance against any aggressor if she wanted to engage in an armed conflict with him.” (Statement of Mahatma Gandhi in The Great Trial after Non Co-operation movement), and “Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest” (Gandhi, An Autobiography, p. 446 (Beacon Press paperback edition). One other thing to keep in mind–he was resisting the British, who in spite of these misdeeds were a much more humane opponent than many of India’s external nation state enemies, who would have historically had no qualms about employing genocide on their neighbors–or their own people, for that matter.
Oath Keepers have vowed to uphold the Constitution, which includes refusing to obey orders to disarm the population. So it’s not them trying to render people of color defenseless–it’s the left, that is, you national socialists (own it, Mac–that’s what you are). And I know it causes outrage among hard core leftists when non-Caucasians don’t toe the collectivist line, but the ones I know in Oath Keepers find being portrayed as racist haters ironic, offensive and wrong-headed, to say the least.
I’ll leave you with two statements from Oath Keepers’ “What We Are Not” statement:
“We are Not advocating or promoting violence towards any organization, group or person,” and “We are Not advocating or promoting any act or acts of aggression against any organization or person for any reason including, but not limited to; race, religion, national origin, political affiliation, gender or sexual orientation.”
This tracks very closely with the “Inclusion Policy” I wrote for the now defunct GunTruths.com website about 15 years ago:
“GunTruths supports the right of all peaceable people to keep and bear arms.
“Your age, race, sex, religion, political party, sexual orientation, or national origin are of no concern to us. Anyone who requires you to disarm is not your friend, and not our friend.
“Only when all peaceable citizens can freely exercise their inalienable right to self defense, and their right to keep and bear arms, will we attain the ultimate safeguard for our mutual protection, as individuals, as members of a community, and as citizens of the Republic.”
Anyone portraying us as violent haters is quite simply and demonstrably a liar. Like the irrational SPLC hater who posted this “Hate Watch” libel.
on August 29th, 2009 at 12:35 am
Sandy,
Do you need the federal government or it’s parasitic agencies to inform you that a group or movement is hateful?
Guns and violence were not mentioned by Alias, so why are you or the SPLC even mentioning it? Who is to stop the federal government from breaking the law?
on August 29th, 2009 at 1:45 pm
All of these questions about the direction of SPLC..
Why are none honestly answered?
I make a statement about Missouri and the MIAC and get censored.
Maybe that is a clue to the above question.
on August 30th, 2009 at 3:43 am
I have to give you guys a lot of credit for putting up our posts, even though it seemed like there was a long delay in them appearing on the board.
It seems that lately many of the longstanding racial hate groups have been scattered to the winds, and I think we all agree that that’s a good thing. But let’s make sure we don’t unfairly label patriots who love their country and want their countrymen to be free, safe, and happy as extremists and lump them into the same category with Neo Nazis, ELF arsonists, and Hezbollah.
on August 30th, 2009 at 10:27 am
“But let’s make sure we don’t unfairly label patriots who love their country and want their countrymen to be free, safe, and happy as extremists and lump them into the same category with Neo Nazis, ELF arsonists, and Hezbollah.”
If tne Oathkeeper website actually does claim Pelosi wears a swastika, they ARE in that same category.
And the Nazis were NEVER socialists and they did not nationalize the German auto industry. None of the automakers were taken over by the government. Not even Ford. If the Oathkeepers are actually claiming this on their website, they are dangerously delusional.
Remember, these are COPS who are in this group. That’s scary.
on August 30th, 2009 at 11:44 am
“George Bush did illegally expand the Executive Branch of the government…”
I’m astonished!!
A reich wingnut is actually questioning the illegal acts of his fearless leader Chimpy!
This is truly astounding.
Because you KNOW where all these anti-government Reich Wingnuts were 5 years ago.
They were waving Bush signs at a Bush rally.
While Bush weakened our rights and made it much easier to declare martial law, they were voting for him.
on August 30th, 2009 at 12:15 pm
I question both Bush and Obama. I fail to see any difference between the two. Let’s see, we are still in Iraq (and will continue to stay there), we are still in Afghanistan (and opium is still doing well there, thank you CIA), we are also in Pakistan now, Bush must have loved that one. We still have torture allowed (rendition is a cowardly approach towards it’s approval), we still have gitmo with no end in sight. We actually have an appeal for imprisonment for futurecrime from Obama, something Bush never would have gotten away with. I don’t have any faith in either party myself. No discernable difference between the two. Just two parties? Two parties which represent all 300 million or so of we Americans. Hardly, just false choices offered. It seems to me that Obama is in bed with the same bankers, brokerss, and drug dealers that Bush was in. All in the name of corporatism; the true political system we have.
on August 30th, 2009 at 3:59 pm
Snorlax….funny how you socialists call Libertarians who fight for our freedoms as “reich wingnuts”….That’s ok though, the Right wing calls us dope smoking 9/11 truthers who believe in conspiracies…I know, I’ve heard Rush Bimbo call us names too, so we can take it. You say where were we when Bush was in office……HAAA!!! we were there protesting all along, we protested the 911 cover-ups, we protested and fought tooth and nail against the “Patriot(less) Act” And we phoned our congressmen and Senators to stop the bailouts before Bush Left office….you know when it was only going to be $600 billion, and the house of representatives actually voted it down, then remember they had that “meeting” where they were given a carrot and a stick and warned that there would be martial law if it did not get it passed, and when they came out they added another 150 billion to the bailouts for their pork projects and passed the bill….Bush was still in office when that happened and we fought it….where were you liberals then? We knew the Banksters and companies like AIG would get their golden parachutes and we warned about it but no one would listen to us. We warned about the general motors bail out, no one would listen. We’ve been warning about NAFTA, the IMF, the WTO and the North American Union. We’ve been warning about the increase in Police Brutality (one more reason why we support oathkeepers), You ask where we were when Bush was in office….Listen to Alex Jones’ Archives, we were trying to expose the Bush dynasty the whole time he was in office, now we are exposing Obama as the Puppet Tyrant Socialist that he is, belonging to the Globalists: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAaQNACwaLw
We were here fighting for our rights when the Neo-Con Nazi’s were in office, now where here while the Liberal Commies are in office and we’ll still be here fighting when the neo-cons are back in office again….
When you finally wake up and realize that the 2 parties are one and the same and understand what freedom means then maybe we can all work together to win our rights back.
I dont care if you are a “conservative” or a “liberal” Any time you impose FORCE on another human being either directly or through elected or hired officials, either as a tax or other means or by violating a persons privacy, then you are taking the rights and freedom away from another individual.
Libertarians are not Anti-government, we are pro-very limited government, and Pro-limited corporate control
…..”Mussolini claimed that Italian Fascism’s economic system of corporatism could be identified as either state capitalism or state socialism, which in either case involved “the bureaucratisation of the economic activities of the nation.”
Sounds like we are living in a Fascist state now anyway you look at it.
on August 30th, 2009 at 4:20 pm
Let me re-phrase part of what I just said….”Libertarians are not anti-government, we are pro – very limited government as well as anti-corporate control. We are not at all against companies turning a profit we just don’t want them lobbying with government to run our lives”
on August 31st, 2009 at 2:12 am
It’s funny, looking at the Hate Map…I don’t see the Racist organization; “La Raza” (The Race) anywhere on the map (imagine if another white group were started and they called themselves “the race”)….I don’t see gangs like the bloods, the crips, MS13, and Los Serranos, I don’t see the Black Panthers, I don’t see ELF, I don’t see PETA, I don’t see any of the gay anti-straight hate groups…..Though I will give credit where credit is due, The Nation of Islam is on the map so SPLC isn’t completely 100% biased solely against white and christian groups……Now don’t get me wrong, it is good to map out the Neo-Nazis and other hate groups, I encourage this but until SPLC quits holding a double standard and quits showing utter biased against mostly “white” groups, then I’m going to consider them as a hate group themselves. Get up some of the “other” hate groups and I may take a second look at this organization.
on August 31st, 2009 at 6:31 am
That “Nazis were socialsts” line really grinds my gears. It’s a Reich Wingnut talking point.
And of course, it’s a lie. Hitler was never a socialist, and he actively courted rich industrialists like Fritz Thyssen. Hitler loved the Junkers and all their money.
If the Reich wingnuts claim Nazis are socialists and Obama’s a socialist, they come to the conclusion that Obama must therefore be a Nazi.
Nevermind that its an absurd logical fallacy. The neocons never let facts and logic get in the way of a good old fashioned smear campaign.
We know the knuckle-dragging Neanderthals in these dangerous groups, but what we don’t know is the extent of their support by the business-suited Right.
I think we’re only seeing the tip of the iceberg.
on August 31st, 2009 at 6:40 am
Cognitive dissonance.
If a Neo-Nazi joined the Oathkeepers, he would have to rationalize the “fact” tha Obama is a Nazi…just like him.
This could cause some heads to explode from the confusion.
on August 31st, 2009 at 10:24 am
Oh, I fully agree that Obama Shouldn’t be equated with Hitler (that would be closer to Bush)….He’s much more like Joseph Stalin or Mao Zedong. I also find it quite interesting how he latched onto using the term “Czar” for his little dictators, and no one in the main stream media picked up on that. “Czar” or “Tsar” comes from the word “Cesar” which means emperor.
on August 31st, 2009 at 2:58 pm
The only question I would ask those that are against the Oath Keepers is, “Why wouldn’t you take an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States?” Those that wouldn’t take such an oath, in my opinion, are traitors to this country. Dees, like Unions did good for people at one time. Corruption has turned them into the problems they set out to solve.
on August 31st, 2009 at 5:52 pm
Wear it, Ex…uh..SnorLax (is that a Dr. Seuss character?). Own it. And grind those gears.
“It is now clear beyond all reasonable doubt that Hitler and his associates believed they were socialists, and that others, including democratic socialists, thought so too…
“The Jew, Hitler told Wagener, was not a socialist, and the Jesus they crucified was the true creator of socialist redemption. As for communists, he opposed them because they created mere herds, Soviet-style, without individual life, and his own ideal was ‘the socialism of nations’ rather than the international socialism of Marx and Lenin. The one and only problem of the age, he told Wagener, was to liberate labour and replace the rule of capital over labour with the rule of labour over capital.”–”Hitler and the socialist dream,” George Watson, “The Independent,” from “The Lost Literature of Socialism.”
So let’s see–we have reasoned scholarly work based on research by a renowned professional, (who, incidentally, characterizes himself as “an active member of the Liberal Democrats”) and then we have…uh…anonymous you and your…uh…opinion. Gee, tough call.
Why you national socialists want to deny who you are says a lot. I know you’d rather we think of you as “liberals,” as all the while you advocate the state having more and more control over every aspect of our lives.
Oh, and as for the business about the Nazis and the auto industry:
In 1942, the Nazis’ obtained a court order to declare Ford-Werke enemy property, and they appointed a custodian and replaced the board of directors. As early as 1935, they implemented regulations on the entire industry requiring all parts be German-made using German raw materials and controlled raw material allocations based on production which they approved. (“Business and industry in Nazi Germany” By Francis R. Nicosia, Jonathan Huener, University of Vermont. Center for Holocaust Studies). And then, of course, we have Adolf and the Volkswagen…So he never went pure textbook socialism–who cares when you have the control? And there was a war on, you know. But ain’t fascism the way it always seems to work out when the shakers and movers figure those “more equal than others” deserve some perks?
And Neo-Nazis, that is, your ideological brethren, aren’t welcome in Oath Keepers–if you’d take a moment to actually investigate instead of knee-jerking, you’d know that instead of continuing to spread that lying meme. Leave it to you leftist haters to do that. I guess that’s all you have.
on August 31st, 2009 at 6:19 pm
Tom the Libertarian probably vote
for Bush twice, then voted for Bob Barr.
Bob Barr is NOT a Libertarian.
Bob Barr is a Bushie who supported Bush’s illegal occupation of Iraq and his doubling of the federal debt to $11 Trillion.
Bob Bar blocked medical marijuana in DC.
Tom the Libertarian thinks the SPLC is racist? No they aren’t, but YOU are, Tom.
on September 1st, 2009 at 3:16 pm
If the S.P.L.C. doesn’t hate you then you’re not really a patriot!
on September 1st, 2009 at 3:19 pm
Snorlax, Libertarians supported Ron Paul who is the only congressman who is completely opposed to imposing force (including taxes) upon individuals, he is the only congressmen who has never wavered in his beliefs, He has voted to abolish the IRS and get us out of Globalist organizations such as the UN, WTO and IMF consistently. He was consistently opposed to the war in Iraq from the very beginning and opposes tyrant organizations such as the FBI and ATF. I don’t know of any Libertarians that supported Bush, if we had our way, there would either be no political parties at all as George Washington believed or at least have more 3rd parties in office as a second best so the 2 Republicrat and Demopublican parties don’t continue to hold a monopoly on our country.
Snorlax, where is your evidence that I am racist? You don’t even know what race I am…You know, I’ve spent the last 8 years of my life as a truck driver trainer, and that I would spend weeks at a time living in a truck with people of all different races….Tell me Snorlax how can a racist tolerate living in confined quarters for extended periods of time with so many different people of all walks of life? And you know half of those people considered themselves as Liberals, yet I could get along with them for the entire month we were on the road. Tell me Snorlax, how long could you get along with a Neo-con for an extended period of time in confined quarters? Tell me how long it would be before you “Hated” that person.
I only point out that SPLC and it’s followers are a hate group because they only select a few hate organizations to oppose(mostly white groups) in order to further their biased agenda, yet hold a double standard when it comes to Left-wing hate groups. Ok, let’s point out neo-nazis and other white supremacist organizations as hate groups, I fully agree to that, but where is LA RAZA (The Race) on their map?, Where are the gangs? where is PETA, Where is ELF? where are all the Left Wing Hate groups? It’s funny how you think only right wingers hate and that the left is incapable of it, yet you socialists spew your intolerant venomous hate on every left wing media show I’ve watched or listened to and to me that shows complete hatred and bigotry on your part. The socialists hate gun owners, they hate business owners, they hate people who try to promote living a “straight” lifestyle and they hate Christians. How can I even consider following an organization with that kind of hipocracy and double standard? Are you so blind you can’t see the double standards in this country? ( “BET”, Black History Month, Black Pride, Black Panthers, La Raza, Gay Pride) Imagine a “White” History month or “Straight Pride” those terms would be listed in a heartbeat as hate speech…..
The problem with socialists is that you are no different than thugs like Rush Bimbo in that you carry water for your party. Both party loyalists are Hippocrates. The socialists whine and complain because conservatives pass legislation that violate our privacy rights, our right to DR assisted suicide, and our right to smoke marijuana, yet you are quick to take away other peoples rights such as constitutionally guaranteed right to keep and bear arms and peoples property rights and peoples right to own their wealth without forced taxation…..The neo-cons complain because we lose our gun rights to socialist laws and policies, and the taxes that socialists impose upon us, yet they still insist on imposing “their” will upon everyone….. See here’s the problem, as long as the 2 tyrant parties keep taking away each others rights, in the end there will be no more rights left for anyone….See you think you have control because you have a socialist in office (he’s no more than another globalist tyrant no different than bush except he’s wearing a black mask), but what you fail to realize is that the pendulum has been swinging back and forth in this country for 200 years and it will swing back to the right again. Let me warn you again…because mark my words; The Pendulum WILL swing back to the right. And each and every time that pendulum swings either way, RIGHT or LEFT, more rights, freedom and privacy are lost…..Why the heck both you left and right wingnuts can’t get that through your thick skulls is beyond me.
I find it amusing how the socialists are right there in agreement with us when we fight for our privacy rights, to legalize marijuana, and to uncover the truth about 9/11, yet the minute we start talking about things like gun rights you automatically call us Right wingers…That’s ok, I’m used to it, like I’ve said, the Right wingers call us dope smoking leftists who believe in 9/11 conspiracies.
So which are we, Right wingers or Lef twingers? I say neither, because you are both wrong in so many ways it’s ridiculous.
I really wish that both parties would quit hijacking movements that we start and claiming it for themselves….We were the first to question 9/11, We were the first to protest against Monsanto and genetically modified food, and we were the first to question NAFTA and yet the socialists jumped on the bandwagon and hijacked our movement….We were the first to coin the words “Tea bagging” and start the tea parties yet the Neo-cons hijacked that movement as well and the socialists enabled it by calling it a conservative movement, it’s not a conservative movement, it’s a freedom movement. We fight for liberty and to stop ANYONE, Conservative or Liberal from imposing force upon us.
The socialists and neo-cons are so similar it’s pathetic
on September 1st, 2009 at 8:08 pm
To Snorlax,
Hitler wasn’t a socialist?
Okay, how about this tidbit from Wikipedia:
Adolf Hitler was an Austrian-born German politician and the leader of the National Socialist German Workers Party (German: Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, abbreviated NSDAP), popularly known as the Nazi Party.
on September 2nd, 2009 at 10:11 pm
James Bates Thayer told us that, “If the S.P.L.C. doesn’t hate you then you’re not really a patriot!” I have been a supporter for many years, and in my one year of teaching I used some of their Teaching Tolerance ideas in the classroom. I suppose though, my thirty one years of military service, with some combat air hours, still means I must not be a patriot since I can see through this organizations ultra thin mask.
As an intelligence professional and as a historian I studied propaganda. A lot of propaganda uses various forms of camouflage, talk abut one thing when your real message is actually something else entirely. That is why the Oath Keepers having the townhall video on their homepage was so significant. It displays the fact that the Oath Keepers are about a great deal more than their Oath, they are really more concerned with a radical far right agenda even if it means relaying out and out false information. The deeper you dig into the site and links, the more disturbing this becomes.
Mr. Thayer’s comment reflects something that is disturbing in a great many of the comments on this post as well. Most of the negative SPLC comments are simply, well, simple minded and angry outbursts of jingoistic noise and nothing more. Unfortunately, there are a number, though the percentage is much less, of the same among supporters of the SPLC.
This is the rhetoric of hate; it stifles fair and reasoned debate, on any issue. Groups like the Oath Keepers, PETA, the KKK or even your neighborhood PTA they deserve an honest fair and scientifically researched investigation into their views and ideals. None of these groups are skin deep, not even home page deep. There is so much deliberately hidden when there is much to hide, as in the case of the Oath Keepers. Thus I dug and what I found was not pretty or patriotic, unless your definition of patriotic eliminates all views except one very narrow far right viewpoint.
Patriots I always thought accepted the concepts of freedom of speech and expression. But apparently not if your name is James Bates Thayer or a member of the Oath Keepers confronting a Congressman.
on September 13th, 2009 at 2:31 am
Tom, being a racist is the blanket charge against anyone who doesn’t support Obama. Myself? Yes, I am white. I’m even from south Georgia. Of course, my top 20 heroes include Rosa Parks, Malcolm X, and MLK, Jr. But, I’m not a democrat or a republican. The mere fact that we have only two parties demonstrate we are just a one party system. That would be the Banker Party, and I’m not a member.
Me? Anarchist. Not that bomb-throwing anarchist the politically ignorant think of, but the true, peace-loving, freedom loving anarchist. The one that doesn’t believe the state is our friend.
These modern liberals believe that government can cure our ailments, despite the rather obvious fact that government has created the very same problems they now profess they would like to fix. Excuse me if I don’t think they’ll do a good job. Even if they are well meaning.
Modern conservatives are now only connected to war machines and the whores of war who profit of the deaths of the youth around the world. The only thing the conservatives are conservative about anymore appears to be freedoms. In this, the conservatives and liberals walk down towards the altar of national poverty hand-in-hand.
I don’t know why anyone seems surprised this site only attacks a very narrow, and racist, hate group list. This organization is so amazingly close to the government, having it’s ear on so many cases, that it is hard to believe it is not tainted by the corruption which infects our government. Just by association.
But in my own failings, I do recognize my own individual prejudices; namely the ignorance we seem to cultivate in our country. It seems to me that had we spent all the money we’ve spent on wars this last century on education, we would not have the economic problems we have today, and the level of dissent would be a lot lower.
But, like the AMA, we will continue to treat symptoms and not concern ourselves with causes. That seems to be the mindset of the SPLC and our government. People get angry and start shouting? Don’t address the root causes, just attack their free speech. And that is but one example. In short, if we don’t stand up, we truly aren’t worthy of the freedoms we were born with.
on September 18th, 2009 at 11:01 am
I’m late to the party – I just got one of the e-mails from my right-wing, racist, birther, ex-military cracker extolling the virtues of this fine Patriotic outfit. If he supports them, that’s all I need to know to start looking under the rocks.
And the KKK was just a service organization made up of patriotic good Christians working to protect the country from those damn Yankees in Washington.
Oath Keepers is just a Reich-wing bunch without the sheets.
on September 24th, 2009 at 1:42 am
by the way Who’s keeping an eye on the radical Left?
on September 24th, 2009 at 8:49 am
Ray, you can bet your bottom dollar it is NOT the SLPC.
on September 24th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
>>>I am soooo fed up with these racists claiming to be “patriots.” They are just hate groups who can’t get over the fact that Obama won the election. Sometimes I wish they would do what they keep talking about and move to another state (or a desert island) and we could surround them with barbed wire so they can’t continue their hate campaigns.
I’m white, I worked to get Obama elected and I have the best health care imaginable. However, even if I do have to pay a few more dollars in taxes, I will gladly do so it if means that everyone in this country has healthcare.
Did you even read the damn article? They started this because they were pissed at Bush. They don’t like that Obama hasn’t repealed any of Bush’s illegal expansions, and is in fact putting in place expansions of his own. These are real patriots who should be commended, who care more about the Constitution and the country than the president. I’d like to go thanks these people myself. SPLC is so worthless.
on September 24th, 2009 at 5:36 pm
JT, even the progressives are starting to regret voting for Obama. No change, just more of the same. That stupid argument that everyone who dislikes his policies (which are an exact copy of Bush’s) must be a racist is running thin. Even with progressives. Get real, pull your head out of that dark space and look around. Are his policies any different than Bush’s? Gee, we still have all of the same things going on in the exact same way. When Bush left, this country was on the verge of a revolution because of his attacks on civil liberties and the Republic form of overnment. Same crap going on, but a racist if you oppose? Get real.
on September 24th, 2009 at 11:11 pm
Funny how the SPLC come out as the real haters on this one. Haters of the constitution that is.
on September 28th, 2009 at 8:03 pm
I AM an Oath Keeper and proud to be one. The oath I took when I joined the military had no statute of limitations. I gave my word to support and defend the Constitution against ALL enemies, foreign and domestic. With the course this government has taken over the past few years, the domestic enemies of Liberty and Freedom seem to out number the foreign. It is more imperative than ever that people who understand the erosion of our Constitutionally protected rights have to be silent no more. We must hold our representatives accountable to the people they are supposed to represent.
I have NO problem with a black President and I doubt my fellow Oath Keepers do either, although Obama really can’t be the President since he isn’t a citizen. Yeah, I’m a “birther” too! What I have a problem with is the federal government way overstepping its bounds and forcing socialist policies on an uninformed public. If you really want to understand the organization and what drives it’s members, check out the Web site at http://www.oathkeepers.org. Anyone who reads and understands the Constitution can see very plainly that this country is not on the course the Founders established. If Oath Keepers can make our voices heard, then I am proud to support them!
on September 30th, 2009 at 2:17 pm
Jim, I was quoting a guy above me, haha. I guess I should have indented or something. I agree with you completely. My comment is the last paragraph.
on September 30th, 2009 at 2:21 pm
>>>>Oath Keepers is just a Reich-wing bunch without the sheets.
Really? Could you point out anything bigoted in their beliefs? If you’re just using guilt by association as your reference point, then since Obama was endorsed by Louis Farrakhan, Obama must be a raving antisemite who believes that whites are the devil and that God took Elijah Muhammad up on a spaceship.
on September 30th, 2009 at 2:39 pm
JT, understood. :)
on September 30th, 2009 at 4:13 pm
>>>It doesn’t matter what these people call themselves. They are an unofficial gang obeying no rules but their own. So, why should anyone trust their motives?
Pretty sure that they are obeying rules. The Constitution
on October 1st, 2009 at 2:39 pm
You better be thankful that these peace officers have taken such a noble oath and reaffirmed that oath. These men and women are prepared to give their lives to protect the very rights that you exercise when you participate in protest, vocalize your grievances or even post on this website.
on October 19th, 2009 at 10:28 am
Wow, many seem to be waking up to the leftist anti Americanism of splc. SPLC see’s a monster under any bed that doesn’t support their leftist fifth column activities. They have chosen the wrong bogey man this time!
on October 19th, 2009 at 12:11 pm
Oh, “Hatewatch.” **I** get it! This is a group that spews hate about people who want to defend the Constitution and then hides behind the epithet ‘racist’ against anyone who disagrees with them.
Who are the REAL HATERS here??
on October 19th, 2009 at 12:13 pm
addendum:
In criticizing Oath Keepers is SPLC now DEFENDING the use of Martial law and the military against US citizens??
on October 20th, 2009 at 8:35 am
Great point jmcaul, how quickly a slippery worm can turn!
on October 21st, 2009 at 12:01 am
Cudos to Mark for setting the record straigh on Hardball tonight….
In saying that the Oath Keepers are largely a group of men and women that are in law enforcement and the military, that are given weapons and authority over the rest of us,and that in itself is well and fine; however, when people with those powers are animated by dark and utterly false conspiracy theories (ie OK’s actually mention on their website that they actually fear that the government will actually be cracking down on Militias and calling them right wing terrorists and so on) Thats the real agenda here, they are driven by fears that have no basis in reality.
And cudos to Hardballs Matthews in saying that the real goal of the OK’s is to obtain a mindset of its members, so that as to stir them up and generate right wing anti government sentiment to generate support for the false conspiracies they promote. He says obviously there is no real imminent threat of the things they mention on their website, (and the OK’s founder agreed to that) and so the only real agenda here is to promote anti government sentiment via their conspiracy theories to further right wing causes.
In my humble opinion, its obvious to me both Mark and Chris are right on target. Why would we support a group that operates in a false reality, based on fears that have no basis in reality? Ill tell you why, because some people are just nuts, thats why. And some (the OKs founder) are simply trying to generate support for the right, under false pretenses, they think its their only chance of survival at this point, to get people all riled up over some really kooky ideas. And some very cynical people just want to believe the worst, it gives them something to do, something to complain and whine about. There is plenty wrong in America now without wasting time on this kind of crap. If you really want to help change things, put your energies into something that is really worthwhile, like ending poverty in America.
on October 22nd, 2009 at 8:43 pm
Wow! No basis in reality? Either you’re incredibly misinformed, stupid or deceptive. I guess you didn’t hear that the new head of home land security is now more concerned with, and issuing orders to be on the look out for:
1) returning vets
2) those that believe the second amendment means what it clearly says
3) people who have read the constitution and are aware of states rights as defined there
4) anti abortion
5) the limited role of the federal government
6) hell, belief in the constitution in general
I could continue. But these are the “new home grown terrorists” that the obama government is concerned about. Sounds more like the minute men from the 1700′s than muslim crazies huh?
And I suppose there were those in Russia, China, Korea and Germany that believed anyone sounding an alarm that the crazy socialists/marxists were going to take over there and destroy freedom had a mental problem and were paranoid,
And now we have “o” attempting to marginalize and eventually shut down opposing news outlets like Fox.
Who is really the crazy? Me, or you JW Schott?
on October 23rd, 2009 at 4:47 pm
“…Sounds more like the minute men from the 1700’s” No. actually sounds much more than the whack jobs militia morons that popped up during the Clinton years and culminated in Okla. City in 1995.
Comparing ‘those in Russia, China, Korea and Germany’ to the United States is a false analogy. None of those nations had ever had any kind of tradition of democracy or 44 constitutional transfers of power. None had anything resembling the vibrant 1st amendment tradition as the US. None had undergone a brutal civil war to defend that constitution. None had anything resembling our Supreme Court.
Pointing out the FACT that Fox is nothing more than a propaganda outlet masquerading as ‘news’ outlet is hardly ‘marginalizing.’ Fox is owned by an unAmerican foreigner and run by a dedicated political operative who goes all the way back to the Nixon White house. It is staffed with misogynists, racists, xenophobes, homophobes, air-headed hot chicks, and liars.
While the marginalized and delusional paranoid foxholes, dittoheads, teabaggers, and anti-abortion cultists hold views that were overwhelmingly rejected by the vast majority of the American people represent only a small minority of even the 20% minority party, to disregard them would be gross incompetence by those charged with defending the country.
on October 23rd, 2009 at 7:08 pm
Placitasroy, I’ll bet your also JW Schott! Ha Ha! I wish you could hear me and many others laughing at you and your pathetic attempt to support the lefts attack on real patriots. Once again, nothing more than smears, accusations and character attacks with absolutely zero facts from the mindless, knee jerk, brainwashed left. Sorry, your Saul Olinsky methods aren’t going to get any traction here! obama and his socialist/marxists have over played their hands. Thanks to talk radio and Fox, center right America is waking up to it. Check out his crashing approval numbers! But then that’s a fact and the likes of you can’t comprehend what those are. I laugh at you! I also predict if obama continues on his present course, he will be under arrest and on trial for treason before he sees a full four years in the White House.
on October 24th, 2009 at 11:10 am
Actually Lee, that MIAC report is also concerned about Ron Paul Supporters, Chrisians, and any political party outside the narrow confines of the Democratic-Republicans. Which is how that party used to identify itself, it was one party then, as now, just more honest about it then. I am guilty on all accounts excepting being a Christian. Sorry, haven’t found much morality in that book that I would bother emulating. If Christians didn’t hate Christ so much, maybe. But they are all about the ten commandments and hating instead. Now, if they paid attention to their namesakes two principles, love god, love thy neighbor and both with all you had, it would be a religion that made some sense, but we all know they hate love. But I digress.
Also Lee, this has not been a constitutionally based government in a very long time. The Civil War was a government change as well as the New Deal Era. Good and bad points with both. But let’s not lie to ourselves and believe that this government has anything at all to do with that constitution. It really is just a piece of paper. One we crapped on with our own cowardice in the frace of authority. We have the government we deserve unfortunately.
on October 25th, 2009 at 10:45 am
“Check out his crashing approval numbers!”
Amazing! After 10,000′s of hours of hate radio, 1,000′s of hours of the Fox freaks spewing distortions, misrepresentations, lying and promoting the teabagging parties, and being engaged in cleaning up the biggest economic mess in 80 years, 2 failed wars, and moving forward on healthcare reform and President Obama’s numbers stay high!
Research 2000/DailyKos tracking Favorable up 1 unfavorable -1 Net= 55/37 http://www.dailykos.com/weeklytrends
And from the latest WaPo poll:
A new Washington Post-ABC News poll shows that support for a government-run health-care plan to compete with private insurers has rebounded from its summertime lows and wins clear majority support from the public.
57 percent approve of the way Obama is handling his job as president and 40 percent disapprove.
The president receives better marks from all Americans for his handling of international affairs and his performance as commander in chief (57 percent approval on each). Slim majorities also approve of how he is dealing the situation with Iran and his winning of the Nobel Peace Prize.
Poll respondents are evenly divided when asked whether they have confidence in Obama to make the right decisions for the country’s future, but just 19 percent express confidence in the Republicans in Congress to do so. Even among Republicans, only 40 percent express confidence in the GOP congressional leadership to make good choices.
The wide gap in partisan leanings and the lack of confidence in the GOP carries into early assessments of the November 2010 midterm elections: Fifty-one percent say they would back the Democratic candidate in their congressional district if the elections were held now, while 39 percent would vote for the Republican. Independents split 45 percent for the Democrat, 41 percent for the Republican.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....9101902502 .
on October 25th, 2009 at 10:50 am
Excellent analysis just posted at dailykos.(Remember the is EXTREMELY accurate and Daily Kos uses the info to allocate donated campaign funds to insure the best bang for the bucks.)
BTW: President Obama gained another point his his favorables and a decrease of a point in the unfavorables. and the GOP lost more ground.
GOP LOOKS GREAT IN SOUTH, NOT SO MUCH IN THE REST OF AMERICA
The latest ABC News/Washington Post poll has Obama with a 57-40 approval rating, which almost mirrors our own Research 2000 55-37 number. Other polls are in similar favorability territory: Fox has it at 55-41, Gallup at 56-40, Quinnipiac at 53-47, NBC/WSJ at 56-33, and so on.
Here’s what those other pollsters don’t do, however — break down their samples by geography.
Break out the south:South Favorable:27 Unfavorable: 68
Rest of USA 67 24
Since January 8, Dems have gone from +8 net favorability to -10 — an 18-point drop.
Republicans have gone from -28 to -46 — an 18 point drop.
And really, I’d rather be the party at -10 than the one at -46. Yet it’s the Republicans prematurely chortling about their big 2010 victories. Such a funny, funny group of people.
Here’s a fine set of geographic numbers:
GENERIC CONGRESSIONAL BALLOT
Dem GOP
All 35 29
South 21 47
NE 51 8
Midwest 37 26
West 36 28
Republicans trail in virtually every issue in every credible poll, and that’s with the South boosting their numbers. Throw geography into the equation, and you realize that yes, the GOP remains a Southern regional rump party, and while their prospects in their home region look pretty darn good, the same can’t be said for the rest of America.
on December 11th, 2009 at 5:32 am
Talk about coming late to the party – this thread eluded me until 11 December 2009. I’ve just sat here and read over the comments. Very remarkable portrait of the chasm in contemporary culture-clash between statists and libertarians.
I would like to thank the many post-makers on this thread who took time and effort to portray so well the thoughtful ideologies on both sides, pro and con Oath Keepers. There is much I could say here now, but the hour is late and I may leave things unsaid in hopes of chancing upon this thread at a more advantageous time in the future. But I should at least state a couple of interesting points which may shed light on the false accusation which says that “Oath Keepers are a hate group”.
For the record – I am a white man from the deep South who nine years ago migrated to Montana in search of natural majesty in landscape and national majesty in traditional American values as exhibited famously by the average Montana citizen. I married a Jewish woman. I am the editor of an “extremist” monthly newspaper named The Montana Messenger …. http://www.themontanamessenger.com
….and my publisher at that newspaper is Jewish. I work closely with the Tea Party movement in Bozeman, Montana, and the leader of that movement is a friend who is also Jewish. Both my publisher and my pal in the Tea Party movement are Oath Keepers. A brief look at the front page of the Oath Keepers website reveals that “Jews For The Preservation Of Firearms Ownership” supports Oath Keepers, and Oath Keepers supports JPFO. As editor of The Montana Messenger I have Aaron Zelman’s permissions to republish items from his website.
So I trust that the above confessions by self shall serve to set some of the record straight here. To that I would add a bit about myself and the Oath Keepers mission.
Personally, I am an honorably-discharged U.S. Marine who quit college to volunteer for Viet Nam duty – and I got it. Having awakened many years later to the sad reality of just what that war was all about, I came to notice upon deep reflection that the government which sent me to Viet Nam was not “America”, was not this “country”, was not this great land and noble people who live and work out their lives in the wonderful tradition I see as “American”. I came to learn that the government is a man-made thing, and thus an imperfect thing, and as the Founders knew that long ago, they set up checks in the founding legal charter which created the Federal government, that tyranny would forever be kept away from the American people. My America is the people and this land on which we all live and work. The government is not that. Not that at all. It now intrudes into every aspect of the lives of those who are the true America – you and me. To deny that is to embrace denial over one’s own reason and perception.
Yes, I’m the state director for Montana Oath Keepers, and I’m also a member of the Board of Directors in the national organization. I was asked by Stewart Rhodes to get on board with Oath Keepers long before our muster on the Lexington Green this past April 19, 2009, for Stewart had known me for a considerable time prior to his getting the idea to create Oath Keepers. We’ve been friends for some years. Stewart and I both have dated internet posts on forums going back through the Bush-43 years, and if you google around on my name you’ll see that I was calling for Bush to be impeached, convicted of monstrous crimes, and sentenced to prison for his evils – all throughout his terms in office.Personally, I don’t think America has had an honest President since Andrew Jackson, except for a few who got themselves assassinated for trying to help the people. I am not one to deify a damned President since this country’s earliest few statesmen. And I think it is way past time that we had a black President, so far as having any President at all goes. I’d also like to see a female President sooner than later. But I distrust the process by which any person today becomes President – they’re schooled and trained by powers which hide behind the Bilderberg group, the Club of Rome, the Trilateral Commission, the CFR, etc etc ad infinitum. I resent that people stand and applaud whenever some damned President walks into a room. The only man I’ve seen in my lifetime who is a true statesman I’d love to see in the White House is the Honorable Congressman Ron Paul. I could embrace American Federal government once again if Ron Paul were in the White House. Anything short of his tenure at the helm falls way below my requirements.
So you see, I’m not “anti-government” – I’m anti-corruption in government. That is what the SPLC, the ADL, and the Montana Human Rights Network fail to distinguish when they try to profile Patriots, libertarians, and Oath Keepers as “extremists” and “hate groups” and “racists” and “anti-government movements”.
Last point in passing – Oath Keepers is our military, our peace officer personnel, our firefighters, and our veteran community. Yes, we know how to use firearms – really well, for we were taught those skills by the Federal government, and many of us were given “on the job” training in war zones. We are the defenders of the Republic. We do not call for any action – we merely call for our membership to lay down their arms if they are ever ordered to violate our citizens’ Constitutional rights. We do not advocate violence – we advocate passive resistance as taught by Gandhi and MLK. The mission of Oath Keepers is to “reach, teach, and inspire” all oath takers to become Oath Keepers. We stress in our outreach activities that the Constitution came first, and from the Constitution came the Federal government, which must always be subservient to the limits and requirements defined in its founding legal document. We note that our Oath is to the Constitution, not to the government. That way, our service in uniform is always done for the people, not for the government. When the Federal government lost sight of the way to honor its own founding document came the need for Oath Keepers.
I have devoted four pages in the December 2009 issue of The Montana Messenger to the charges levied against myself and Oath Keepers by the SPLC, the ADL, and the MHRN. I am mailing a copy to each of those organizations.
I would invite SPLC to engage me in conversation about their stated charges that Oath Keepers is a problem for law enforcement, that we are racists, that we are anti-government, that we are extremists, etc.
Meanwhile, I’m standing in Montana for all that America has stood for in my life. I fought communism in Viet Nam and I’ll damn sure fight it here in Montana. Call me what you will. I’m here. I’m awake. I’m aware. I’m with it. I get it. And I can take it. :)
Thanks for reading.
Salute!
Elias
http://www.oathkeepers.org/oath/
on December 11th, 2009 at 12:14 pm
Thanks for all you do and don’t worry about being late here at the racist SPLC for only blowhard liberals that hate this country pay any attention here anyway.
Thanks again
Mark
10 miles from Lexington Ma.
Didn’t serve but still a member of Oath Keepers.
on December 26th, 2009 at 11:37 pm
I would like to thank SPLC and Chris Mattews for their valuable assistance in doing more to promote the cause of the honoring and protection of our beloved constitution tha any other single action!
The 48 hours after Stewart Rhodes made both Mattews and that creepy looking representative from SPLC look like blithering idiots, Oath Keepers membership more than tripled, and the increases have not slowed for months since.
Again thank you from the bottom of our hearts,
John McC,
High Desert (CA) Oath Keepers
on February 24th, 2010 at 3:32 am
This thread is dead, but did anyone else notice that everyone defending SPLC on this issue brought up “reich-wing” or the “Republicans”. Not once did anyone defending the Oath Keepers make mention of political affiliation with the exception of Libertarian ideologies.
People who see this country as politically divided clearly haven’t woken up yet.